Advice Line with Jeffrey Hollender of Seventh Generation
Guy Raz hosts an Advice Line episode with Seventh Generation co-founder Jeffrey Hollender, discussing his new book and providing business advice to three early-stage entrepreneurs. The callers represent a toddler-friendly furniture company, a cherry vinegar brand, and a plant-based dog food company, each seeking guidance on marketing, messaging, and growth strategies.
Summary
The episode opens with Guy Raz welcoming back Jeffrey Hollender, co-founder of Seventh Generation, which was acquired by Unilever for $600-700 million in 2016. Jeffrey discusses his new book 'Built for a Better World,' which aims to share lessons from running a purpose-driven business and argues that responsible business practices haven't yet solved the world's major problems. He notes a phenomenon called 'green hushing,' where companies continue sustainable practices but avoid publicizing them due to the current political climate. Jeffrey emphasizes that young entrepreneurs need to understand the financial business case for purpose-driven business to attract investors.
The first caller, Christina Molinaro of 25 and Pine (Dayton, Ohio), co-founded a furniture company with her husband that makes convertible furniture usable by both toddlers and adults. The business grew organically through social media, including a viral TikTok video, generating $600,000 in total sales over five years. Guy and Jeffrey advised her to amplify best-performing content with paid advertising, use humor in videos, pursue micro-influencers with 5,000-10,000 followers by sending free products, and build an email newsletter to communicate additional product benefits and stories.
The second caller, Phil Halstead of Red Truck Orchards (Northport, Michigan), produces premium cherry vinegar from tart Montmorency cherries on his farm, priced at $17.99 per bottle. His purpose-driven mission is to support distressed local farms in Northwest Michigan. Guy and Jeffrey advised him to nail down a simple daily usage message (morning ritual, salad dressing, afternoon sparkling water drink), fix SEO confusion between 'cherry' and 'sherry' vinegar, expand sampling programs into larger markets like Chicago, and improve post-purchase email engagement to drive repeat purchases.
The third caller, Caroline Buck of Petaluma (Oakland, California), co-founded a direct-to-consumer plant-based dog food company with her husband. The business is 99% online with a subscription model, currently sold in Erewhon stores and small pet boutiques. The main challenge is marketing a polarizing product without triggering outrage. Guy suggested leaning into consumer skepticism as a storytelling device, acknowledging doubts upfront in ads and social media. Jeffrey emphasized the need to clearly prove the product is better—not just as good—as alternatives, and backed by health studies. Guy also recommended introducing dog treats as a lower-barrier entry point to attract new customers.
About this episode
<p>Today’s callers: Kristina in Ohio looks for avenues beyond organic social media to market her furniture designed for toddlers and parents alike. Then Phil in Michigan considers the best messaging to brew interest in his farm-made cherry vinegar. And Caroline in California scouts new ways to cultivate curiosity around her plant-based dog food.</p><p>Plus, Jeffrey discusses the quiet momentum of social businesses as they navigate ‘greenhushing’ and a polarized political climate.</p><p>Thank you to the founders of Twenty Five and Pine, Red Truck Orchards, and Petaluma for being a part of our show.</p><p><br /></p><p>If you’d like to be featured on a future Advice Line episode—where Guy and former show guests take questions from early-stage founders—leave us a one-minute message that tells us about your business and a specific question you’d like answered. Send a voice memo to <a href="mailto:[email protected]" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">[email protected]</a> or call 1-800-433-1298.</p><p>And be sure to listen to <a href="https://wondery.com/shows/how-i-built-this/episode/10386-seventh-generation-alan-newman-and-jeffrey-hollender/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Seventh Generation’s founding story</a> as told by Jeffrey and his co-founder Alan in 2021.</p><p><br /></p><p>This episode was produced by Sam Paulson with music by Ramtin Arablouei. It was edited by John Isabella. Our audio engineer was Jimmy Keeley.</p><p>You can follow HIBT on <a href="https://x.com/HowIBuiltThis" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">X</a> & <a href="https://www.instagram.com/howibuiltthis/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Instagram</a> and sign up for Guy’s free newsletter at <a href="http://guyraz.com/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">guyraz.com</a> or on <a href="https://guyraz.substack.com/" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">Substack</a>.</p><p>See Privacy Policy at <a href="https://art19.com/privacy" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://art19.com/privacy</a> and California Privacy Notice at <a href="https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info" rel="noopener noreferrer" target="_blank">https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info</a>.</p>
Key Insights
- Jeffrey Hollender argues that 'green hushing' has emerged as a real phenomenon where companies continue sustainable and DEI practices but stop publicizing them due to political risk, creating a confusing landscape for the responsible business movement.
- Jeffrey contends that young entrepreneurs must understand and articulate the financial business case for purpose-driven practices — not just the moral one — because investors need evidence that responsible operations generate better returns and competitive advantage.
- Jeffrey reflects that Seventh Generation's obsession with rapid growth (50% year-over-year) was damaging to employees and the organization, and argues that moderate, sustainable growth is healthier than maximum-speed scaling.
- Guy Raz argues that for polarizing products like plant-based dog food, leaning into consumer skepticism — rather than avoiding it — is a more effective marketing strategy, using doubt as the opening of the brand story rather than suppressing it.
- Jeffrey argues that a product positioned as 'as good as' competitors is insufficient for survival; brands must clearly articulate and prove they are better, supported by evidence, to justify customer switching behavior.
- Guy observes that for a D2C brand like Petaluma with 99% online sales, investing energy in retail expansion is a distraction, and the subscription model for dog food is particularly well-suited to e-commerce due to the product's weight, bulk, and repeat-purchase nature.
- Jeffrey suggests that micro-influencers with as few as 5,000-10,000 followers are more accessible and cost-effective for small brands than large influencers, and are often willing to promote products without payment if they genuinely like them.
- Guy argues that for Red Truck Orchards, fixing search engine confusion between 'cherry vinegar' and 'sherry vinegar' is a critical and overlooked technical issue that is likely misdirecting potential customers away from the brand.
Topics
Transcript
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